Unification

All things related to beginning Zen Practice. Here is where to exchange information between those that have already started Zen training and those planning to do so.

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Enver M.
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Re: Unification

Post by Enver M. » Fri Oct 26, 2018 4:35 am

I love you ---

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Enver M.
Posts: 82
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Location: Ankara, turkey

Re: Unification

Post by Enver M. » Fri Oct 26, 2018 4:42 am

It's 7 o'clock am here.At one side the sun is rising.On the other side there is the scene of the mountains which were never seen this precise before.All I can say is this.
Hedera wrote:
Thu Oct 25, 2018 8:55 am
So clumsy are words,
so misleading are thoughts,
so illusive are even the best koans,

Everything lost into itself

With each breath being all that i own
what else can i do but listen,
to the timeless song of the great blue mountain
and tend to the path of old.

Kaya
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2018 11:03 pm

Re: Unification

Post by Kaya » Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:44 am

Enver M. wrote:
Wed Oct 24, 2018 2:58 pm
Welcome Kaya,

If i have practiced i could understand you.seems you have practice.
so, before practicing there is an ideal,
after practicing there is no self!.
If I understand, you have not practiced, despite exhorting others to practice. No problem! Encouragement is always welcome. You do, however, claim to know about practice, including before and after.

Self does not dissipate as a result of practice, in my understanding. In Buddhism, "the belief in a fixed and abiding self" is a sickness* (internal sickness, contrasted with a second, external, sickness: the desire for a "real" object)*. This belief, not self, is eliminated, because there was never a self to begin with. This is a fundamental realization.

You may not have access to a teacher where you live. Perhaps one of the teachers here would be receptive to giving expert advice/answers that neither I nor others here can presume to provide.

*Thoughts without a thinker: psychotherapy from a Buddhist perspective / Mark Epstein, 1995, pp. 50 - 51

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Enver M.
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Location: Ankara, turkey

Re: Unification

Post by Enver M. » Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:08 am

Kaya wrote:
Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:44 am
Enver M. wrote:
Wed Oct 24, 2018 2:58 pm
Welcome Kaya,

If i have practiced i could understand you.seems you have practice.
so, before practicing there is an ideal,
after practicing there is no self!.
If I understand, you have not practiced, despite exhorting others to practice. No problem! Encouragement is always welcome.
Hello Kaya,
I can not say my practice is zero.i newly begin to practice zazen.but i believe i have gain some knowledge in last 15 years by reading and mostly
pondering on the fundemental subjects.because of that i use my mind my comments mostly based on comparative analyses.i have also a method called Following White Method which is originally belong to me.that which is a method to to considered to turn on your intuitive mind and enlighten your way by.i see its many benefits.

despite all my only aim to get this site is to succesfully accomplish to carry the zen practice in my whole life.i have said this in my first post when i first joined this forum.so when i encourage someone here to practice i encouage my self in truth.this is another page.

on the other hand my english is limited.what i have meaned by the word practice at the question in the beginning is '"to have been accomplished some practice or level" in the meaning.
You do, however, claim to know about practice, including before and after.
of couse i have some idea.otherwise how could we be interactive here and find the right way.i just love to talk about zen more than some others.
Self does not dissipate as a result of practice, in my understanding. In Buddhism, "the belief in a fixed and abiding self" is a sickness* (internal sickness, contrasted with a second, external, sickness: the desire for a "real" object)*. This belief, not self, is eliminated, because there was never a self to begin with. This is a fundamental realization.
There is a difference between saying there is no self and there is no self in the beginning.that is what i was investigating in the beginning actually.
You may not have access to a teacher where you live. Perhaps one of the teachers here would be receptive to giving expert advice/answers that neither I nor others here can presume to provide.

*Thoughts without a thinker: psychotherapy from a Buddhist perspective / Mark Epstein, 1995, pp. 50 - 51
I'm glad of the synergy of the forum.In the streaming of the running thoughts of the disscussions i always find a way to run through my own practice!

Kaya
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Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2018 11:03 pm

Re: Unification

Post by Kaya » Tue Oct 30, 2018 11:39 pm

Enver M. wrote:
Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:08 am
i have also a method called Following White Method which is originally belong to me.that which is a method to to considered to turn on your intuitive mind and enlighten your way by.i see its many benefits.
Please say more about your Following White Method.

Thanks!

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Enver M.
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Re: Unification

Post by Enver M. » Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:23 am

Following White Method
or White Method

It is originated from Bodhidharma's shoe case.

It is basicaly considered to turn on your intuitive mind and so to be enlighten your way.

It is quite simple;

When your non-thinking thought match with a white color in or around you; you act, talk or speak etc whatever you do.

black is bad.

and not much of a significance of other colors.

------------------------------------------------------

Here you need a non-thinking thought first.
This is the base.
And secondly not much of significance of the other colors or happennings.

These two basic rules prepare you to get ready for a meditation mind mentaly.It succesfuly turn your life into a meditative life and make you get ready.

It clears all your doubts.So you can easily focus on the need.

From daily activities to complex philosophical problems you can use.

I personally use it in my all basic moves in daily life.It opens my way in all means.You should try it to have an idea.From the beginning to the end with all its possibilities it allow or provide you the best solutions or the results.

It is very possible that it save one's life many times in a life time.

It gives you possitive energy.You look more possitive to the people and to the world.It can be use in the cure of the many mind sicknesses either.

the list can make longer

May we all get benefit from!

Kaya
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2018 11:03 pm

Re: Unification

Post by Kaya » Wed Oct 31, 2018 9:26 pm

Enver M. wrote:
Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:23 am
Following White Method
or White Method

It is originated from Bodhidharma's shoe case.
You mean case as in koan?
Enver M. wrote:
Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:23 am
It is basicaly considered to turn on your intuitive mind and so to be enlighten your way.

It is quite simple;

When your non-thinking thought match with a white color in or around you; you act, talk or speak etc whatever you do.

black is bad.

and not much of a significance of other colors.

I'm afraid I don't understand this yet. The color "white" is a cue to ... act intuitively? (I guess black is "bad" because it is the opposite of white, and contains no colors?)

Enver M. wrote:
Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:23 am
Here you need a non-thinking thought first.
This is the base.
And secondly not much of significance of the other colors or happennings.
Well, as for the first part: okay!

As for the second part, how was this determined?
Enver M. wrote:
Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:23 am
These two basic rules prepare you to get ready for a meditation mind mentaly.It succesfuly turn your life into a meditative life and make you get ready.

It clears all your doubts.So you can easily focus on the need.

From daily activities to complex philosophical problems you can use.

I personally use it in my all basic moves in daily life.It opens my way in all means.You should try it to have an idea.From the beginning to the end with all its possibilities it allow or provide you the best solutions or the results.

It is very possible that it save one's life many times in a life time.

It gives you possitive energy.You look more possitive to the people and to the world.It can be use in the cure of the many mind sicknesses either.

the list can make longer

May we all get benefit from!
It is wonderful that you derive such a great benefit from your method.

Thanks for sharing!

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Enver M.
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Location: Ankara, turkey

Re: Unification

Post by Enver M. » Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:34 am

Kaya wrote:
Wed Oct 31, 2018 9:26 pm
Enver M. wrote:
Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:23 am
Following White Method
or White Method

It is originated from Bodhidharma's shoe case.
You mean case as in koan?
What was the case?



THE VERY MOMENT I've been talking about.

As you see different shapes and colors in your daily life.One moment you look to a chair, the other moment you look to the wall, or any tool or shape.live your normal life no problem with it...but the moment when a NON-THINKING thought appears in your mind where were you looking? or specifically at that very moment which color you see? does your non-thinking thought match with white or not?

black is the opposite and have a negative meaning. it tells you will have some problems with your (non-thinking) thought.whatever it is.that you aim to.

If that match with any other color (outside of white or black) i don't give any significance.

as an important note: you don't focus on white or any thought. it happens just in daily life flows.

Absolutely from small decisions to big ones, from small problems to bigers, in all aspect of the daily life it provide you the right choise in the right time with all its possibilities.

:105:

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fuki
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Re: Unification

Post by fuki » Fri Nov 02, 2018 6:40 pm

desert_woodworker wrote:
Fri Oct 26, 2018 1:37 am
Enver M. wrote:
Wed Oct 24, 2018 8:47 am
Here in Turkey our life had turned to Cat ---
Lucky man... .

My Turkish Van cat is shown below.

--Joe


helva_25Mar2011.jpg
Ah to know the state beyond thought I only have to look into your eyes (Helva)
:111:
meldpunt seksueel misbruik in boeddhistische gemeenschappen.
https://meldpuntbg.nl/

IZIhttp://www.zeninstitute.org/en/iziae/main.html

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desert_woodworker
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Re: Unification

Post by desert_woodworker » Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:46 pm

Marcel,
fuki wrote:
Fri Nov 02, 2018 6:40 pm
Ah to know the state beyond thought I only have to look into your eyes (Helva) :111:
:D

Thanks, Old Relative. Good to hear from you.

Her gaze is intent, and yet relaxed. No thoughts (perhaps) that stick to her, or that she sticks to, to dam-up and impede her attention.

A lesson at the tip of each of her three million and a half hairs... .

She is one, and unified, with whatever is the case.

--Joe

(she likes a good spell in the fresh air and sun of the desert Autumn, outdoors in her tent)

Helva_in_tent.jpg
In tent, and intent
.
Helva_in_tent.jpg (431.82 KiB) Viewed 109 times

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