Fruitzilla wrote: ↑
Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:42 am
Friend wrote: ↑
Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:08 am
clyde wrote: ↑
Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:55 am
No, not now. I just explained, “it was my intention when I wrote, “not for Zen monks, priests, or teachers,” to mean ordained persons.”
And the difference is one is ordained and the other isn’t.
Very good. After you get some rest, I look forward to your explanation.
Dude, you have 5 posts on this forum, 4 in this topic. I don't see why you should be entitled to an explanation.
I can top that, 330+, thousands on ZFI. not that it means a thing. given the responses, perhaps it's time for further explanation/consideration. I realize that mega conversations/ management issues are not typically allowed on forums. I think this is an exception. Perhaps we can all learn something.
I also realize that this is a difficult situation for Clyde since he has generously agreed to moderate knowing full well the intensities involved and as well, respecting his own limits with regard to moderating teachers. Quite a few of us go back to nearly day 1 at ZFI, seen it all. As the zen koan says, walk a straight line on a crooked road.
First, it seems we have to appreciate those folks who may not post and are silent participants. They are in the majority here. I always notice the silent ones logged on. I usually check to see who's on, it's rarely more than 1/2 members, often 6+ others. As it turns out, I am a silent one these days. Thank you joop and friend for stepping forward.
I can only speak from my piece of the rock. Putting aside the elephant in the room, ie, this is a dying beast since before ZFI went off the air. What is possible? How can we honor all the voices? Where is the possibility for growth? Frankly, I, on the one hand, I am sick to death of the word practice... this is not a dress rehearsal. here we are. Understand, that statement is not offered as a judgement about practice itself.
Things to consider:
Without teachers, there is no one driving the bus. ppl are left to their own delusions. Teachers offer a balance. I'm not a fan of looking to authority, but it is an important piece at times. Zen does follow a prescribed pattern to be called zen and/or zen buddhism. that has always been the rub.
This forum, from the beginning, seems to be a reaction to past experience, formed in the hopes of doing better. all good. As a result, there have been artifical barriers placed in the river to control it. how's it working so far? As a result, we have lost ppl who were irritating to that purpose, some for better, most for worse. In my mind, this is not a reason to continue (fixing past mistakes). This forum has the possibility of much more substance and it can also die a natural death.
I am completely unreliable in knowing how a forum should work. Who can know where the wild horses go?
Have to wonder about the sustainability of a forum when individual preferences are at it's base. Change is inevitable. We are not running a corporation here.
There are no teachers here... Our teachers Meido and Guo Gu, understandably are moving on with large projects of their own. I'm grateful for knowing them, wish them well. I see the distinction between ordained and lay teachers as meaningless. what purpose does this serve?
I honor Clyde's thoughtful approach and wish to act in integrity. I dunno, the only thing I can suggest is to consider again the challenge of moderating teachers as a path to growth. At the moment, there are no teachers to moderate and it's a rare thing for teachers to require moderation. If such a need arises, I'd suggest that a consultation is called for.... no need to make a unilateral decision with regard to them.
Otherwise, we could wind up with a bird with one wing. Food for thought.