Yes, lovely. In Zen retreat, follow the forms with one's preferences left aside, then outside the retreat ... drink tea however the hell someone wants, or a milk or a pepsi. In art class, a time to learn and master the classical techniques and forms, and a time to express. About the same.fuki wrote: ↑Thu Jun 11, 2020 10:35 pmSure hence I said "no problem following any program" I like bootcamp as I'm quite made/build to follow (sensible) orders, including from teachers/parents as a kid (again if sensible and "just") I actually thrive like that without the whole "option" thing. I prefer a grocery list then ppl asking me "what do you want to eat" Who cares/I don't know, just tell me what to eat! So within the sangha I never experience resistence or even a sense of following, the narrative aint there. Yet everyone is different and ppl have picked up aquired flavours along the way, so in that sense I see no issue in liking to see a tea ceremony different, when I sit with friends at home we do things a bit different then in the official sangha, no problem, at someone elses house its a bit different again.jundocohen wrote: ↑Thu Jun 11, 2020 10:08 pm
As in the military boot camp, some things are done for the simple reason of causing people to put the ego aside and commit to the group. Why would you be so egotistical that you demand the right to do what you want in getting your tea? In retreat or a Zen sitting, we put aside some of the "ways I want" and follow the structure precisely because it is not always what "I want." Further, any ceremony is like a dance, and when committing to the motions of the dance, one can lose one's small self and find oneself again.
The "ego" or "sense of self" is just fabricated software, yet part of life or the human experience, one can use it skillfully or not, its not something good or bad only the way it's used, so it doesnt automatically mean egotistical to "want" something, it can be creative, deepening (sangha) relations actually. Otherwise it is just hardware without any "juice" Anyways "ego" is also just a word, I often see it's a word thrown around easily while it doesnt mean the same to everyone, like "God" for instance. No problem putting it aside but can also just let it function freely (as it's not an entity/identity anyway) but I agree ego in the sense you put it can be disruptive or cause conflict/division, but too much "no-ego" in religious institutes can be abused or manipulated too or result in bad conduct by teachers as you know.
Hopefully, along the way, folks learn that peace and contentment is not about being handed "what I want." If life gives you a pepsi, drink pepsi. If life hands you vinegar, drink vinegar. Like that.