personal/meditation experience(s)

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fuki
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personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by fuki » Wed Jul 01, 2020 5:48 pm

Normally I'm not so keen on "sharing experiences" as afterall, they're just comings and goings and nothing to be 'excited' about or 'at loss' at, in the same way I'm not interested in the comings and goings of furniture in this house, whether it are objects like chairs and tables or the contents of consciousness, however "grand" or "spiritual" But I'd like to share this one because it shows the beauty of the unexpected.

Preparing to sit as usual and a few minutes in about to spontaneously "slip" into samadhi, I noticed a pulsating sensation from the "sahasrara" first very fast and repetitive gradually more subtle and very slow, when it stopped everything "split open" and became luminous expanding in all directions, within that I noticed a person appearing which I recognized as me about 25 years ago, within a specific situation and room in the time, I entered that person/situation within the vast luminous expanse and 'remembered' that situation completely forgotten which was at a time when I was suicidal and haunted by dark mental factors, I won't go into details but that moment I did myself physical and psychological harm, what happened next I brought attention back to the body sitting here and now and felt the weight of the body again, but bringing that situation 25 years ago in the now and vice versa, meaning as if that person 25 years ago, knew what I 'know' now and was just sitting zazen "together" as if we could smile at "each other" knowing it was all good, the times became "one" and we smiled and coming back to just this body sitting, I noticed knots or tensions stored in the body, head and parts of neck release which have been stuck for years (I realize now lol)

The words above don't do it justice for I couldn't put it into words, why I'm sharing this is, I always (in arrogance or just foolishness) thought I was beyond all that, I am "beyond" in the sense that there's no psychological or emotional traces of pain from past events (though that's perfectly fine if there are!), but they are stored in our bodies, every fiber of our being (apparently) This happened spontaneously probably from watching Guo Gu's "loving kindness" talk, among with uncountable causes and conditions ofcourse. https://youtu.be/np8XGe7Ljzw

Anyway hope you don't mind sharing, it is just to show the value of spiritual friendship, practising together, the value of a place like this, whether offline or online. It's good to connect, never having a sense of gain or loss, spontaneously things happen as a result of hanging out/practising with the "right people" So thanks to Guo Gu and everyone, hope it inspires someone "out there" (also writing this for some non-buddhist ppl on fb so they might one day be inspired to pick up practise and appreciate the gift of buddhadharma)
:namaste:
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avisitor
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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by avisitor » Wed Jul 01, 2020 6:57 pm

Thanks Fuki for sharing.
Really have no idea what it was you experience
But, understand the idea that the memory of the past is stored in the body.
My body reminds me of my past activities with inflamation and aches.

p22
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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by p22 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 7:56 pm

I don't know that anyone or anything actually heals- To look at any this or that past occurrence with different eyes also changes the way what occurred is seen, aware that what happened was multi-faceted, not blue but reflecting- Only to realize at another time it was murky or simply looking produced a new view-

Carol shared a personal story once about everlasting love- What I took away from the lesson was that endless love is infinite avenues, that it isn't necessarily always recognized but there-

As far as the body parts thing, el g said something once about the body carrying stuff in certain palaces- I worked with that over the years since and am happy to report that it's no longer chronically in the same spot, but dispersed, into little bits, equally distributed! Thank you! :105:

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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by fuki » Wed Jul 01, 2020 10:19 pm

Avi, thanks. No idea too (congrats!) some "things" aren't needed to understand, enough to not misunderstand :D
I just put it down as "energy residues, or unspent energies", transformed, released etc
another event passed by, but a learnful one :)

Teresa, lovely. Thanks :115:

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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by jundocohen » Thu Jul 02, 2020 2:26 am

Of course, what an experience means to you is up to your own heart, and in consultation with your particular teacher if you have one. I just offer a personal view about something like that which I experienced (actually, there is more than one time).

All manner of things can bubble up in Zazen. I relived once a car accident I was in at age 8 as real as if I was actually experiencing it. I am pretty sure it was just a memory that bubbled up, even if my mental state at the time made it dreamlike and very tangible. Meditation forms which emphasize a very intense samadhi or like concentrated state might trigger that more. I doubt that i was actually communing with my young self, except to the extent that I am he and he is I and we are just our present memories and experiences.

In any event, we don't put much stock in such things beyond being rather informative and showing that the scars of trauma linger deep.

Best is just to be at home in this life right here, in one's sitting one here, letting the past go even if the scars remain.

Gassho, J

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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by michaeljc » Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:02 am

I once described my deepest experience to a teacher and have regretted this ever since

For me it's a bit like talking about one's wedding night in detail

But, I find myself judging the depth of others' experience with such things, based on how they pitch their posts on the likes of this forum - and their general attitudes/behavior. Silly me

Many that project the deepest understanding do not talk about their experiences. They play them down, even

"Get over it, get on with it" I would say

:namaste:

m

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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by avisitor » Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:21 am

michaeljc wrote:
Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:02 am
I once described my deepest experience to a teacher and have regretted this ever since
Yeah, same here.
But, I realized that anything experienced other than true awakening can be a hindrance
Cause one keeps going back to the memory
So, one must make a choice and move forward

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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by p22 » Thu Jul 02, 2020 4:22 am

Well, Michael, mate .. 😊

If the details of your wedding night were anything like Marcel's dark night of the soul .. sorry for your luck ..

All of my marriages .. Oh, nevermind ..

People can become uncomfortable, dis-eased .., by "candid, personal speaking"- So, dismiss it- Which in itself, is a sickness-
The same way ego "plays down" pain-

It doesn't matter what label people slap on pain, theirs or others, it doesn't take the hurt away or what happened-

Revisiting some point in time with kind eyes (Metta) lessens the severity of the recollection-

:namaste:

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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by michaeljc » Thu Jul 02, 2020 9:47 am

avisitor wrote:
Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:21 am
michaeljc wrote:
Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:02 am
I once described my deepest experience to a teacher and have regretted this ever since
Yeah, same here.
But, I realized that anything experienced other than true awakening can be a hindrance
Cause one keeps going back to the memory
So, one must make a choice and move forward
According to Meido a true awakening can be a hindrance and that this is only the beginning after which the real work starts

I trust this man

M

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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by fuki » Thu Jul 02, 2020 10:20 am

avisitor wrote:
Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:21 am
michaeljc wrote:
Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:02 am
I once described my deepest experience to a teacher and have regretted this ever since
Yeah, same here.
But, I realized that anything experienced other than true awakening can be a hindrance
Cause one keeps going back to the memory
So, one must make a choice and move forward
Anything can be a hindrance based on grasping/attachment, same applies to memory, theres no reason to avoid experience or avoid talking about it, that itself can become an attachment or "wrong view" As mentioned experiences are like furniture, with palms open any experience can freely come and go, palms open does not mean grasping fingers. Dont sit or talk with ppl with closed fists or fabricated walls (not directed at anyone in particular) as far as the intention of sharing yesterdays event, that was included in the OP, as far as sharing any experience with others, that depends on the individual, so do or don't, all fine. Ofcourse ppl shape their understanding according to their own perception, so thats fine too, I mostly remain free from the lure of interpretation. Thanks to Teresa, and "apologies" for the dominant "male" thingies :mrgreen:
:115:

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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by fuki » Thu Jul 02, 2020 10:26 am

michaeljc wrote:
Thu Jul 02, 2020 9:47 am
According to Meido a true awakening can be a hindrance and that this is only the beginning after which the real work starts
I've never heared a teacher or "true practisioner" say otherwise, ofcourse anything can be a hindrance, and ofcourse there is no end to practise/work.

Trust your own innate Wisdom., teachers words are also just words, which are helpful guidance/tuning (but you cant take a teachers word and apply/project them on everyone) but if teachers words are processed cerebrally....well as Joe said;
"don't believe a word"

The function of a dharma family is to inspire and deepen our practise, not to go into a fixed "yes" "no" mode

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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by fuki » Thu Jul 02, 2020 11:06 am

michaeljc wrote:
Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:02 am

For me it's a bit like talking about one's wedding night in detail
A while ago talking to a dutch dharma friend she told me she didnt speak of her practise easily because she said it was something very personal. I understand it but for myself theres no such thing as personal or private, but that might be due to causes and conditions like being raised very openly, by females mostly. I can talk about sex or my wedding night with everyone, including my mom and vice versa, as ppl might have noticed in talking with Larry in "chat function" I just have no sense of "privateness" Its different for everyone, and it's all fine. I avoid no subject or "personal detail" of my life, even if society/culture frowns upon it (hypocritically) whether anything in society or "zen culture" I'm an open book, though rarely share it unless I'm moved too, in this case to show my relation with Guo Gu and showing how a dharma talk can bring "hidden" things about, which without clyde/zenspace/interconnectedness wouldnt have occured (so also a thanks to all ppl here) , also to inspire some non-buddhist friends who are locked suffering in a dark mental cage to give them some hope/possibility, so its just sharing, nothing to do with "my experience" nor a "awakening" discussion, it may inspire people or not...all fine.

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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by avisitor » Fri Jul 03, 2020 12:05 am

michaeljc wrote:
Thu Jul 02, 2020 9:47 am
avisitor wrote:
Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:21 am
michaeljc wrote:
Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:02 am
I once described my deepest experience to a teacher and have regretted this ever since
Yeah, same here.
But, I realized that anything experienced other than true awakening can be a hindrance
Cause one keeps going back to the memory
So, one must make a choice and move forward
According to Meido a true awakening can be a hindrance and that this is only the beginning after which the real work starts

I trust this man

M
Yes, I too trust in the teacher, Meido.
And do believe that it can be a hindrance too.
However, there are different depths of awakening
And true, that is when the real work starts.

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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by fuki » Fri Jul 03, 2020 1:18 am

jundocohen wrote:
Thu Jul 02, 2020 2:26 am
Of course, what an experience means to you is up to your own heart, and in consultation with your particular teacher if you have one. I just offer a personal view about something like that which I experienced (actually, there is more than one time).
Yes Guo Gu is my teacher, and I've consulted with him.
All manner of things can bubble up in Zazen. I relived once a car accident I was in at age 8 as real as if I was actually experiencing it. I am pretty sure it was just a memory that bubbled up, even if my mental state at the time made it dreamlike and very tangible. Meditation forms which emphasize a very intense samadhi or like concentrated state might trigger that more. I doubt that i was actually communing with my young self, except to the extent that I am he and he is I and we are just our present memories and experiences.
Thanks for sharing.
In any event, we don't put much stock in such things beyond being rather informative and showing that the scars of trauma linger deep.
Yes, and there's work to be done, not by some will, but its a spontaneous happening. No stock indeed, I've had thousands of them, just rearranging some furniture, never mistaken for the room.
Best is just to be at home in this life right here, in one's sitting one here, letting the past go even if the scars remain.
Gassho, J
Yes, to be where one is, is sufficient. The past is the past, I wouldn't know where to keep it actually, just like the present 🙃 In any case bringing the past in the 'now' and in the now one always be a victim of the past. So always open for anything which presents itself, irrespective of (the fantasy of) the three times, healing/transforming is good, it are the fruits of buddhadharma. This "life right here" must also not be made into a "thing" though it can be rather informative. It's good to 'liberate' that 'person' from 25 years ago, apparently "his" unspent energies were "locked" in this "form" Uprooting vasanas is always a joy, for the benefit for "sentient beings" Not to make "sentient beings" into a "thing" ofcourse.
:109:

Thanks for sharing Jundo, and for the bubbles, cheers.
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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by avisitor » Sun Jul 05, 2020 3:26 am

Have found many regrets pop up and disturb my practice
Things from my past that I wish I could change
And that has become such an ingrain habit
It is tough to let go unless there is something to break the habit

One of the hardest things I had to do was to quit smoking cigarettes.
Socially acceptable at the time and relatively easy to get.
Drugs are easier to quit due to lack of funds and illegal.
Although it may not seem easy to heroin addicts.

Effort and the faith that it can be done
One moment at a time
The desire or want becomes less and less
Then one day it does go. Never quite gone.
Have had recurring dreams of doing it all again
To be mired in the scene with no out.
Sucking it in and letting it go
And the relief (high) of the drug

Yeah, practice to let go
Not with the mind of the addict
Not with wishes and desires
But, with real effort and strong faith.
Over time, it transforms us.

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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by p22 » Mon Jul 06, 2020 4:41 am

Image

Yep- Got my uninsured car impounded at 3AM because I had a craving-

Long ago and far away ..

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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by avisitor » Mon Jul 06, 2020 2:19 pm

p22 wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 4:41 am
Yep- Got my uninsured car impounded at 3AM because I had a craving-

Long ago and far away ..
At 3 AM, should have been sleeping in bed.
Being up at 3 AM, having cravings??
Is something bothering you??
Is there anything you want to talk about??

Car impounded .. means fees for impound lot, state DMV, insurance, and whatever fee they choose to add on ... expensive
Did you get your cravings satisfied??

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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by fuki » Mon Jul 06, 2020 4:05 pm

"Individually wrapped" :D

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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by p22 » Mon Jul 06, 2020 4:31 pm

I wanted Ho Ho's ..

It was an event that I regretted but now understand that it was part and parcel to ongoing patterns I wasn't aware of-

A drop of water isn't too little to make a difference ..

If you look at the dharma vegan discussion, what occurred within it was a collective admission of disinterest- In other words, the earth as a whole withstood yet another blow- It received additional wounds, so to speak, by dismissing previous injury, all due to dependency of preference-

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Re: personal/meditation experience(s)

Post by fuki » Mon Jul 06, 2020 4:38 pm

p22 wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 4:31 pm
I wanted Ho Ho's ..

It was an event that I regretted but now understand that it was part and parcel to ongoing patterns I wasn't aware of-

A drop of water isn't too little to make a difference ..

If you look at the dharma vegan discussion, what occurred within it was a collective admission of disinterest- In other words, the earth as a whole withstood yet another blow- It received additional wounds, so to speak, by dismissing previous injury, all due to dependency of preference-
Ace, thanks for sharing your personal insights/experiences, memories/experiences indeed are a good servant, if one is willing to take a shine and share (and not keep them within an individually wrapped cocoon) :hatsoff:
:111:

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