photographs you have made.

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desert_woodworker
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Re: photographs you have made.

Post by desert_woodworker » Fri Jan 11, 2019 8:15 pm

We had a bit of a sunset last evening in the desert, between winter rainstorms. --Joe


sunset_10_Jan_2019.jpg
sunset_10_Jan_2019.jpg (668.64 KiB) Viewed 977 times
Ignorance is to be ignorant of one's original mind. - Ma Tsu

Liberation is awakening to one's original nature. - Ma Tsu

A guest never knows how much to laugh at a family joke. -Henny Youngman

Bodhi-Mind is working for the good of others. -Hakuin

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fuki
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Re: photographs you have made.

Post by fuki » Fri Jan 11, 2019 8:41 pm

Meraviglioso, grazie!
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fuki
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Re: photographs you have made.

Post by fuki » Sat Jan 12, 2019 2:53 am

desert_woodworker wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 2:10 pm


Good luck with the photography, Marcel, photographing dreams, and planets. Perhaps I can help: I've discovered hundreds of minor planets that way, several trans-Neptunian objects, and have four comet discoveries to my name. I've been privileged to use big hammers (large telescopes), but amateur-sized telescopes can score big, too.

And, I wish you would paint! Anyone can paint. Just assemble the materials, and start, and continue. It's like "meditation" or yoga-practice in that way: "just begin, and continue". ;) For proper meditation, one may need a teacher, but for painting, you do not! :lol:

(ha-ha, Marcel: I don't 'advocate" dreamless sleep. But several years ago at ZFI I mentioned -- and you may be remembering this -- that dreamless-sleep was indeed one of the "properties" or facts of the awakened state. I mean, this was my experience for several months. I think there are also some references to dream-less sleep in the older Ch'an and Zen literature, though I don't recall it being mentioned by Western writers, say, in the past 100 years since Buddhist practice has become a little bit known in Western countries to Western people. But I've experienced that it's a part of the landscape of the awakened state each time, for the length of time that the awakened state lasts: weeks; months; etc. "No mind, no dreams", we could say. Or, no illusions/delusions. But it's not permanent, ...in my experience so far)

Yours in sawdust and photographs,

--Joe
Meneer Joe,

"No!" it's the other way around, I'm a natural when it comes to "meditation" but fortunately receiving more and more guidance/practise in able to "do stuff" (like keith's Scotty) Funny enough I'm bringing "zen" to unknown non-religious bodhisattva circles and help them with dukkha-stuff and they help me with being "out there" for the sake of sentient beings, it's a beautiful marriage of form and function that is manifesting. (no teacher-student or giver-receiver distinction bs needed)

'Thanks for the support but I've "tried" a few times as my mom was a painter, but it's just not my thingy, painting with pictures and other abstract thingies like the almost taboo Buddhist word "love" are more the "talents of quicksilver fuki" (skilled with guitar too) Act-ually nothing ever is permanent or impermanent lol, though they can be great pointers/medicine where needed.

I received this telescope a few months ago from a friend, who bought a new one and thus gave me his old one, I haven't used it yet.
Any "good" you think?

Image

Image
meldpunt seksueel misbruik in boeddhistische gemeenschappen.
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Kaya

Dreams

Post by Kaya » Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:34 pm

desert_woodworker wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 4:25 pm
I have not seen studies in sleep-labs of rapid-eye movement during sleep of awakened people. Probably no one has. Until then, it's mere dictum and incorrect to say that "all" people dream.

Sorry to whack your little dictum hypothesis, but there is plenty of valid and reliable research on dreams to assert so. Also, so-called awakened people would doubtless participate in such in roughly the same proportion as they appear in the population.
desert_woodworker wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 4:25 pm
The awakened state, then, would seem to be one in which, during sleep, the so-called "alpha" brain waves usually correlated with dream-reports simply do not arise (have no need to arise; serve no needed purpose).
Hypothesis only.
desert_woodworker wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 4:25 pm
. . .during sleep of awakened people.
Good unintended oxymoronic humor!

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Larry
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Re: Dreams

Post by Larry » Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:50 pm

Kaya wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:34 pm
desert_woodworker wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 4:25 pm
. . .during sleep of awakened people.
Good unintended oxymoronic humor!
:D

Maybe one of those koan thingies :D

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fuki
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Re: photographs you have made.

Post by fuki » Sat Jan 12, 2019 8:15 pm

why make it "re:dreams" in the photograph thread, just post it in the on-topic thread where we were dicussing dreams?

I might report you guys to Clyde, good reason to get him out of his preferred activity and into moderating :106:
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Kaya

Re: photographs you have made.

Post by Kaya » Sat Jan 12, 2019 8:40 pm

That would be a good idea: move all of it as appropriate.

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desert_woodworker
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Re: Dreams (WAS: photographs you have made.)

Post by desert_woodworker » Sat Jan 12, 2019 10:34 pm

Kaya wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:34 pm
desert_woodworker wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 4:25 pm
I have not seen studies in sleep-labs of rapid-eye movement during sleep of awakened people. Probably no one has. Until then, it's mere dictum and incorrect to say that "all" people dream.

Sorry to whack your little dictum hypothesis, but there is plenty of valid and reliable research on dreams to assert so. Also, so-called awakened people would doubtless participate in such in roughly the same proportion as they appear in the population.
Your comment is still dictum, and specious.

Show us the data. Or at least the analysis of it. That is, you will have to PROVE your assertion that "all people dream". Else, there's nothing to it at all.

'til then, the topic of wonderfully dreamless sleep in the awakened state is open, and should interest everyone... who's interested. ;-)

rgds,

--Joe

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desert_woodworker
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Re: photographs you have made.

Post by desert_woodworker » Sat Jan 12, 2019 10:49 pm

Fuki,
fuki wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 2:53 am
I received this telescope a few months ago from a friend, who bought a new one and thus gave me his old one, I haven't used it yet.Any "good" you think?
A great 'scope! Lucky YOU!

It looks like a "Go-To" alt-azimuthly-mounted 90-mm catadioptric computer-controlled telescope. But I cannot read the maker's name, nor can I tell the optical prescription because I cannot see the front (opening) of the 'scope.

This is a very advanced telescope, but can in fact be very easy to use, because of its design-orientation toward the general public.

Optically, I bet it's great, and will show you many things. I suggest you try it out on the Moon, first, because that's very easy to do, and very breath-taking.

Pls. let me know the maker, and the model number of the 'scope, if you wish. You can also download complete "Instructions" from the maker; makers invariably have a website!, and "User Manuals" are usually lodged there, as well as other downloads. Wishes for good viewing, and,

Clear skies,

--Joe

(can't successfully attach a photo, because the site now says "Sorry, the site's Attachment-quota has been reached". Clyde?, can you cure this? Tnx).

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fuki
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Re: photographs you have made.

Post by fuki » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:44 pm

Wow, Joe - thanks for the offer and expertise (now I feel like using it, although weeks without moon vision, cloud"y"-rainy)

Image

Image

Image

Don't recognize this apparition, it appears in the bathroom too, a mystery :lol:

Image
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desert_woodworker
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Re: photographs you have made.

Post by desert_woodworker » Sun Jan 13, 2019 12:34 am

Excellent, excellent! 'scope, Fuki. I wish I had a friend like yours. ;-)

Even better than 90mm, your 'scope is 102mm. We'd call that "a four-inch".

"Celestron" is a great international brand, with a 50-year history of excellence. Celebrate!

Not sure from your photo of the front ("Objective") end whether this is a Maksutov design ("prescription"), or a Schmidt-Cassegrain. Wonderful to see it.

Use it in good health! And I hope you'll show neighbor-kids some stuff through it, some nights: they might get interested and become the first folks on Mars, or join a great international colony on the Moon: they might send you a Moon-rock, or a Mars-rock, for getting them interested and inspired.

--Joe

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desert_woodworker
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Re: photographs you have made.

Post by desert_woodworker » Sun Jan 13, 2019 12:43 am

Marcel, is it like this (a Maksutov-Cassegrain)?

(scroll down to "Celestron NexStar 4SE ", and click on the "Video" arrow on the Video button.

http://celestron.factoryoutletstore.com ... 20102%20mm

--Joe

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fuki
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Re: photographs you have made.

Post by fuki » Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:03 am

desert_woodworker wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 12:34 am
Use it in good health! And I hope you'll show neighbor-kids some stuff through it, some nights: they might get interested and become the first folks on Mars, or join a great international colony on the Moon: they might send you a Moon-rock, or a Mars-rock, for getting them interested and inspired.

--Joe
Chef,

Thank you for the inspiration! I'm sure we will one day be looking at (or from) the stars "together" or together.
I'm happy to know you 'approve' of the scope, still being happy with my nikon coolpix great zoom I didn't expect too much from the telescope but you made me enthousiastic on using it on the very first clear sky (which if predictions are accurate will not be this week, or the next)
desert_woodworker wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 12:43 am
Marcel, is it like this (a Maksutov-Cassegrain)?

(scroll down to "Celestron NexStar 4SE ", and click on the "Video" arrow on the Video button.

http://celestron.factoryoutletstore.com ... 20102%20mm

--Joe
Yes, thanks!
Didn't get the software so I'll ask my friend is he still has that or see if I can download it, also not sure about the 'computer' for it seems it has an old fashioned telephone line entree? We don't have telephone lines anymore it's all via glassfiber cable these days. But I'll figure it out. :)
meldpunt seksueel misbruik in boeddhistische gemeenschappen.
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Kaya

Re: Dreams (WAS: photographs you have made.)

Post by Kaya » Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:17 am

desert_woodworker wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 10:34 pm
Kaya wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:34 pm
desert_woodworker wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 4:25 pm
I have not seen studies in sleep-labs of rapid-eye movement during sleep of awakened people. Probably no one has. Until then, it's mere dictum and incorrect to say that "all" people dream.

Sorry to whack your little dictum hypothesis, but there is plenty of valid and reliable research on dreams to assert so. Also, so-called awakened people would doubtless participate in such in roughly the same proportion as they appear in the population.
Your comment is still dictum, and specious.

Show us the data. Or at least the analysis of it. That is, you will have to PROVE your assertion that "all people dream". Else, there's nothing to it at all.

'til then, the topic of wonderfully dreamless sleep in the awakened state is open, and should interest everyone... who's interested. ;-)

rgds,

--Joe
Siegel J.M. (2005). "REM Sleep." Ch. 10 in Principles and Practice of Sleep Medicine. 4th ed. M.H. Kryger, T. Roth, & W.C. Dement, eds. Elsevier. 120–135. Accessed July 21, 2010. Psychology.uiowa.edu Archived November 23, 2012, at the Wayback Machine.

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fuki
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Re: Dreams (WAS: photographs you have made.)

Post by fuki » Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:29 am

Kaya wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:17 am
Siegel J.M. (2005). "REM Sleep." Ch. 10 in Principles and Practice of Sleep Medicine. 4th ed. M.H. Kryger, T. Roth, & W.C. Dement, eds. Elsevier. 120–135. Accessed July 21, 2010. Psychology.uiowa.edu Archived November 23, 2012, at the Wayback Machine.
Joe, et all if you do respond,
please continue here
viewtopic.php?f=6&p=11293#p11293

It's getting messy in the picture thread.
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desert_woodworker
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Re: Dreams (WAS: photographs you have made.)

Post by desert_woodworker » Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:30 am

Kaya wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:17 am
Siegel J.M. (2005). "REM Sleep." Ch. 10 in Principles and Practice of Sleep Medicine. 4th ed. M.H. Kryger, T. Roth, & W.C. Dement, eds. Elsevier. 120–135. Accessed July 21, 2010. Psychology.uiowa.edu Archived November 23, 2012, at the Wayback Machine.
What's the upshot, in your words? Did the fellers study Zen Buddhist practitioners, "in" freshly from an awakening? If not, well, ... .

Perhaps you'll give us a synopsis based on the study's population, regarding the above question. That's what would count.

But the cohort available for such a study (of awakened sleepers) is likely to be slim, unless the participants were recruited soon after, say, Rohatsu sesshin time. Thus, do not be so loose in your assertion that "all" people dream. The ones in question MAY not have been studied. ;)

My claim is that there are no dreams for such a person, given a genuine awakening. That is all. Classical Ch'an and Zen Buddhist literature also support this. I am also talking about personal experience.

Strong practice,

--Joe

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desert_woodworker
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Re: Dreams (WAS: photographs you have made.)

Post by desert_woodworker » Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:53 am

fuki wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:29 am
It's getting messy in the picture thread.
I acted on auto-pilot/driverless-car-control, before your fine encouragement and invitation... .

To "un-mess-i-fy" it:

<the_scream_cat.jpg>

(oops: forgot momentarily that attachments are currently verboten)

The image is also HERE ("cat" at the left), ala Edvard Munch:

http://www.pinterest.com/pin/494973815275179126/

--Joe

EDIT: Now able to post an image. Thanks again, El Gato for the software tweak of/to the Board.


the_scream_cat.jpg
the_scream_cat.jpg (74.68 KiB) Viewed 799 times
Last edited by desert_woodworker on Sun Jan 13, 2019 4:26 am, edited 1 time in total.

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lindama
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Re: Dreams (WAS: photographs you have made.)

Post by lindama » Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:56 am

desert_woodworker wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:30 am
My claim is that there are no dreams for such a person, given a genuine awakening. That is all. Classical Ch'an and Zen Buddhist literature also support this. I am also talking about personal experience.

agree Joe. I've also heard Tibetan lamas say the same

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fuki
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Re: Dreams (WAS: photographs you have made.)

Post by fuki » Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:59 am

My favourite Munch edit!

"Befriending the mind" (*Waves to Crystal*)
Image
Last edited by fuki on Sun Jan 13, 2019 2:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Kaya

Re: Dreams (WAS: photographs you have made.)

Post by Kaya » Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:59 am

desert_woodworker wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:30 am

My claim is that there are no dreams for such a person, given a genuine awakening. . .I am also talking about personal experience.
Very sad loss, imo.

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