What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

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What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by fuki » Tue Jun 02, 2020 12:18 pm

Just putting it out there...causes and conditions locally known as "Buddhism" and causes and conditions locally known as "Veganism" Three videos to share dairy/eggs/honey (skipping the obvious meat one)






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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by Nothing » Wed Jun 03, 2020 9:24 am

For countless years the bitter stew of hate goes boiling on.
Its vengeful broth is ocean deep, impossible to calm.
To learn the cause of all this conflict,
Terror, bombs and war,
Listen to the cries at midnight by the butcher's door.
“Here it is--right now. Start thinking about it and you miss it.”
― Huang Po

https://beingwithoutself.org/retreats/

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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by fuki » Wed Jun 03, 2020 12:12 pm

Nothing wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 9:24 am
For countless years the bitter stew of hate goes boiling on.
Its vengeful broth is ocean deep, impossible to calm.
To learn the cause of all this conflict,
Terror, bombs and war,
Listen to the cries at midnight by the butcher's door.
Thanks for sharing that brother :D
Yes that poem demonstrates one cannot seperate the causes/conditions of war with what's happening in factory farming. It's kind of amazing how deluded we are as "humans" that we think we can resolve symptoms like "racism" "sexism" "which like "speciesism" are branches/manifestations of the same poisoned/sick tree (greed, hatred, ignorance)
No scriptural knowledge of "interdependence" or "karma" is useful if we don't see our own collective blindspots. Chinese/Korean Buddhist don't eat meat but that's about it I'm afraid, hardly any teacher/sangha promotes a "vegan" lifestyle, I mean the first precept?

https://tricycle.org/magazine/first-precept/
Speciesism is a misguided belief that one species is more important than another. This toxic mindset is deeply ingrained in our society, and it results in all kinds of negative consequences.

From the time we are young, most humans are conditioned to view certain species as worthy of care and compassion and others as unworthy—all based on arbitrary human preferences. Intentionally or not, parents, teachers, the media, and other influences send children the message that puppies and kittens are “friends,” cows and chickens are “food,” and rats and mice are “pests.” Most children are also taught that human desires, needs, and interests always trump those of any other species.

As a result, we learn to ignore our own conscience, which tells us that it’s wrong to mistreat others. We convince ourselves that we have the “right” to imprison animals in laboratories, experiment on them, and kill them because it might help humans. We tell ourselves that it’s OK to eat ice cream made from cow’s milk because our desire for dessert outweighs a mother cow’s right to nurse and care for her calf. That it’s OK to steal sheep’s wool for sweaters and scarves and ducks’ feathers for pillows. That keeping orcas in barren tanks for profit and “entertainment” is acceptable and that the enjoyment we get from casting a baited hook into the water to catch fish matters more than the pain inflicted on them when they’re pierced through the lip and yanked into an environment in which they can’t breathe. Humans use speciesism to try to justify every kind of cruelty imaginable.
I hope more people (especially teachers) "wake up" to promote a "vegan" "non-harm" way of living.
"One Body, Great Compassion"
🙏

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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by p22 » Thu Jun 04, 2020 5:10 pm

I live by a lake that come summer is eerie green due to toxic blooms resulting from agricultural runoff, from the growing of edible vegetation-

It kills-

Agriculture is a collective mess-

It can attach itself to particulate matter and travel ..

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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by p22 » Thu Jun 04, 2020 5:12 pm

I see no reason why it wouldn't get into pith too ..

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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by fuki » Fri Jun 05, 2020 9:21 pm

“You must reconcile yourself with The Animal Kingdom. What right do you have to hurt an animal? Your job is to protect the Animal Kingdom. Your body does not require meat to be healthy. When you eat meat you absorb the terror, the suffering of the animal. Animals share the same universal origin, consciousness of omniscient love. There is no spirituality without compassion. Compassion is your true nature. Therefore, live in the path of non-harm, Ahimsa, to all living beings. Be merciful. Your job is to become a conduit of gentle loving kindness in this earthly embodiment. Regardless of what is occurring in the world around you, remain in the unchanging all pervading Reality of compassion, loving kindness. Happiness ensues.”
~Robert Adams
33988581f1f027adad88cb72a6bb3d17--spiritual-wisdom.jpg
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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by Larry » Sat Jun 06, 2020 3:02 pm


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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by p22 » Sat Jun 06, 2020 4:35 pm

Please pass the kool-aid!

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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by Larry » Sat Jun 06, 2020 7:52 pm

:D

The jury is still out as to whether Adams was wonky or if it’s just Strouth 🙂

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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by el gatito » Sun Jun 07, 2020 5:47 pm

fuki wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 9:21 pm
"...Animals share the same universal origin, consciousness of omniscient love..."

...
~Robert Adams
What is the main difference between plants and animals? I had to study the "Molecular Biology of the Cell (a Uni textbook)" recently, to have a better idea of what the modern (i.e. "Moderna") vaccine-developers are about, and the book is quite interesting reading. What do you think is the "material" basis for the "consciousness" that is not present within plants? If I cut a portion of the leaf of an Aloe Vera plant, and post a detailed video, does it look comfortable for the plant to undergo such procedure?

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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by fuki » Sun Jun 07, 2020 5:56 pm

el gatito wrote:
Sun Jun 07, 2020 5:47 pm
What do you think is the "material" basis for the "consciousness" that is not present within plants?
I don't know El, I'm not a "scientist" like that, though I enjoy reading anyone's 'revelation' on the 'matter' Your question ofcourse relates to the brain consciousness, i.e. consciousness manifested in form and the universal message of "being" in each vehicle, ofcourse regarding to Capital Consciousness, everything is an appearance in Consciousness, so ofcourse plants are 'present' though might not have the brain-thingy like other species, though trees for instance communicate with their roots under ground, a whole chemical world where mother trees even decide how much food their children trees get, so trees to feel pain/pleasure, warmth love etc too, but since I'm not a tree (from the conscious focal point speaking as a 'human') I couldn't say for sure what they 'have' or 'lack, they might feel/experience so much more then human could imagine based on their brain condition.
:111:

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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by el gatito » Sun Jun 07, 2020 6:05 pm

So, even from a "scientific" point of view, going as deeply as this is possible, it seems that many mechanisms of inter-cell communication within a plant remain "unclear". And from the "spiritual" point of view, "everything is Consciousness".

Yet, quite often on Internet forums, discussions where there are "meat eating" posters, and their opponents, tend to develop a bit... you know how. Irrespective of whether this is a "worldly" forum or a "spiritual".

If one is killing an animal, or they are destroying a plant, one sort of molecular rearrangement is transferred into another one, is that not so?
Last edited by el gatito on Sun Jun 07, 2020 6:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by Larry » Sun Jun 07, 2020 6:08 pm

This reminds me of the old “Secret Life of Plants” book in the 1970’s.

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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by fuki » Sun Jun 07, 2020 6:10 pm

Larry wrote:
Sun Jun 07, 2020 6:08 pm
This reminds me of the old “Secret Life of Plants” book in the 1970’s.
Never read that one, but there is an 'updated' version from Peter Wohlleben
(I have it but never read it) :D

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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by el gatito » Sun Jun 07, 2020 6:12 pm

Larry wrote:
Sun Jun 07, 2020 6:08 pm
This reminds me of the old “Secret Life of Plants” book in the 1970’s.
Actually, I read the "Molecular Biology of the Cell" as a programmer, and it is really fascinating how the "material" part of life is all about simply coding and programming.

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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by fuki » Sun Jun 07, 2020 6:14 pm

el gatito wrote:
Sun Jun 07, 2020 6:05 pm
So, even from a "scientific" point of view, going as deeply as this is possible, it seems that many mechanisms of inter-cell communication within a plant remain "unclear". And from the "spiritual" point of view, "everything is Consciousness".

Yet, quite often on Internet forums, discussions where there are "meat eating" posters, and their opponents, tend to develop a bit... you know how. Irrespective of whether this is a "worldly" forum or a "spiritual".

If one is killing an animal, or they are destroying a plant, one sort of molecular rearrangement is transferred into another one, is that not so?
For me (though ppl think I have an "vegan" agenda) it's never about the "killing" but about unneccesary harm/torture etc and ofcourse we know taking a plant (and replanting/replacing the limbs of mother nature with new seeds) is not to be compared with the torture in factory farming, and 'humans' can (plus its healthier) on a "vegan" diet, but for the "scientists" "spiritualists" etc....
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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by fuki » Sun Jun 07, 2020 6:18 pm

el gatito wrote:
Sun Jun 07, 2020 6:12 pm
Larry wrote:
Sun Jun 07, 2020 6:08 pm
This reminds me of the old “Secret Life of Plants” book in the 1970’s.
Actually, I read the "Molecular Biology of the Cell" as a programmer, and it is really fascinating how the "material" part of life is all about simply coding and programming.
Yes, the "matter" is just a "gross" frequancy/vibrant of consciousness, very funny how "spiritual" people talk about "leaving the material world behind" "liberation" "emptying samsara" etcetera ;)

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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by p22 » Sun Jun 07, 2020 6:58 pm

Harm is a direct result of agricultural practices, even the kindest tenders cannot prevent it, from home yardens to farms- It all runs off into the water and can become airborne-

People consume vegetables and fruits that have been incredibly forced, their flesh becomes this fibrous network of yuck- Grown in one country then shipped to another, exposed whatever along the way- And then gets consumed-

I'm not being judgeee-ee-e ... But it's a shared responsibility thing-

There was a chemical being used in agriculture that altered the sex of frogs!

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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by el gatito » Sun Jun 07, 2020 7:03 pm

Does fuki's cat eat fish?

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Re: What's wrong with.... (the "dharmavegan" topic)

Post by fuki » Sun Jun 07, 2020 7:28 pm

el gatito wrote:
Sun Jun 07, 2020 7:03 pm
Does fuki's cat eat fish?
Cat food, yes.
I have consulted with many vetenarians but can't confirm cats can eat vegan (yet), with dogs no problem they can eat vegan dog food (though check if the company is certified)

The pet industry is a problem, I would never buy a pet from breeders, all my pets have been rescues from animal shalters or adopted, we have like 3-4 million cats in the netherlands and around like 18 million people, it's crazy. People think it's fine to buy pets but again wherever you follow the money, there's cruelty, please dont ever buy a puppy or any animal form breeders or pet stores, even with so called certified breeders behind the scenes many puppies have died before you get your "healthy puppy" From my angle of vision the whole "pet industry" and "pet keeping" should have never happened, unless it's a wild/stray animal's choice to visit humans and be a companion

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